Category: Active

Today's podcast notes eerily similar stories in the New York Times and the Washington Post on Trump's supposed troubles with MAGA—leading us to ask, is there such a thing as MAGA without Trump or independent from Trump? Give a listen.

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Is this the future of MAGA?

Tucker Carlson’s interview with the white nationalist influencer Nick Fuentes has caused a firestorm on the right. Carlson and Fuentes’s friendly chat about American Jews — whether they fit into this country or were loyal to Israel above all — was the kind of conversation that for decades would have been unimaginable among mainstream figures in politics. And by crossing that line, Carlson was making a statement — about the power of Fuentes’s movement and the future of MAGA.

To help me think through this, I wanted to talk to the political writer John Ganz. He’s studied the roots of antisemitism on the right and has followed the evolution of MAGA closely. He’s behind the newsletter Unpopular Front and the author of “When the Clock Broke: Con Men, Conspiracists, and How America Cracked Up in the Early 1990s.”

This episode contains strong language.

Mentioned:

“Unpopular Front” by John Ganz

“Finding Neverland” by John Ganz

“Groyperfication” by John Ganz

Book Recommendations:

Taking America Back by David Austin Walsh

Furious Minds by Laura K. Field

Prophets of Deceit by Norbert Guterman & Leo Lowenthal

Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at ezrakleinshow@nytimes.com.

You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of “The Ezra Klein Show” at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.

This episode of “The Ezra Klein Show” was produced by Jack McCordick. Fact-checking by Ashley Braun. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Isaac Jones. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The show’s production team also includes Marie Cascione, Annie Galvin, Rollin Hu, Kristin Lin, Emma Kehlbeck, Marina King and Jan Kobal. Original music by Pat McCusker. Audience strategy by Kristina Samulewski and Shannon Busta. The director of New York Times Opinion Audio is Annie-Rose Strasser.

Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.

Democrats release a new batch of Jeffrey Epstein's emails—including messages suggesting that Trump knew what Epstein was doing and spent time with one of his victims. Republicans fire back with 20,000 more pages of documents, Trump insists it's all a hoax, and Congress moves toward a vote that could force DOJ to release the full Epstein files. Jon and Dan break down how bad this is for Trump and his vanity building projects, the government's belated reopening, the lingering shutdown hangover, the future of ACA subsidies, and a sneaky provision that would let eight GOP senators sue the federal government. They also discuss Trump's disastrous interview with Laura Ingraham, his baffling affordability pivot, and MAGA outrage over Kash Patel using an FBI jet as his own private shuttle service. Then, Texas State Rep. James Talarico stops by to talk about why he's jumping into the Democratic primary to unseat Senator John Cornyn.

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