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The Ezra Klein Show - What the Shutdown Is Really About

There’s a serious high-stakes policy fight at the heart of this.

The Democrats didn’t pick a fight over authoritarianism or tariffs or masked immigration agents in the streets. They picked one over health care. And the issue here is very real. Huge health insurance subsidies passed under President Joe Biden are set to expire at the end of this year, threatening to make health care premiums skyrocket and kick millions off their insurance.

Neera Tanden was one of the architects of the Affordable Care Act and has worked in Democratic policymaking for decades. She is the president of the Center for American Progress and was a director of Biden’s Domestic Policy Council. I asked her on the show to lay out the policy stakes of the shutdown and what a deal might look like.

Mentioned:

KFF Health Tracking Poll

The Time Tax by Annie Lowrey

One Big Beautiful Bill Act

Book Recommendations:

Why Nations Fail by Daron Acemoglu and James A. Robinson

The Sirens’ Call by Chris Hayes

End Times by Peter Turchin

Thoughts? Guest suggestions? Email us at ezrakleinshow@nytimes.com.

You can find transcripts (posted midday) and more episodes of “The Ezra Klein Show” at nytimes.com/ezra-klein-podcast, and you can find Ezra on Twitter @ezraklein. Book recommendations from all our guests are listed at https://www.nytimes.com/article/ezra-klein-show-book-recs.

This episode of “The Ezra Klein Show” was produced by Rollin Hu. Fact-checking by Michelle Harris and Kate Sinclair. Our senior engineer is Jeff Geld, with additional mixing by Aman Sahota. Our executive producer is Claire Gordon. The show’s production team also includes Marie Cascione, Annie Galvin, Kristin Lin, Jack McCordick, Marina King and Jan Kobal. Original music by Pat McCusker. Audience strategy by Kristina Samulewski and Shannon Busta. The director of New York Times Opinion Audio is Annie-Rose Strasser.

Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.

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Everything Everywhere Daily - The Gateway Arch

In the midst of the Great Depression, the City of St. Louis wanted to create a monument to the city’s role in the westward expansion of the United States and general waterfront improvement.

It took thirty years, but they eventually created their monument with the assistance of the Federal Government. When it was completed, it was a structure like no other on Earth. 

It was a 660-foot-tall freestanding stainless steel arch. It required innovations not just in design and architecture, but in materials, construction, and even elevators. 

Learn more about the Gateway Arch, how and why it was built, on this episode of Everything Everywhere Daily.


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The Daily Detail - The Daily Detail for 10.8.25

Alabama

  • Sen. Tuberville reacts to news that FBI under Biden surveilled him and others
  • Former state worker is sentenced to prison for Medicaid fraud
  • AL Sheriff's association director says criminal gang activity is in Montgomery
  • Two organization to receive DOE grant $ to expand charter schools in state
  • Hoover Zoning committee reschedules rezoning debate for Islamic school
  • WH official uses AL city as example for when National Guard comes in

National

  • Trump says firing of government workers to begin by end of week
  • SCOTUS hears case out of CO re: ban on conversion therapy
  • FBI fires agents involved with Jack Smith and spying on GOP Senators
  • creators of AI reveal how terrorists and commies are abusing the system
  • Former Navy Seal weighs in on "oddities" of Charlie Kirk assassination
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More or Less: Behind the Stats - Does half the UK get more in benefits than they pay in tax?

Tim Harford investigates some of the numbers in the news. This week:

The Daily Mail says that over half of the UK population live in households that get more in benefits than they pay in tax - is it true?

Do some billionaires earn more in a night than the population of Bournemouth earns in a year? New Green leader Zack Polanski seems to think so - we scrutinise the figures.

Are older generations getting smarter?

Have 77% of Gen-Z brought a parent along to a job interview? Really?

If you’ve seen a number you think we should take a look at, email the team: moreorless@bbc.co.uk

Presenter: Tim Harford Reporter: Lizzy McNeill Producer: Nathan Gower Series producer: Tom Colls Production co-ordinator: Maria Ogundele Sound mix: Duncan Hannant Editor: Richard Vadon

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NBN Book of the Day - Ragini Tharoor Srinivasan, “Overdetermined: How Indian English Literature Becomes Ethnic, Postcolonial, and Anglophone” (Columbia UP, 2025)

Why is it so difficult to account for the role of identity in literary studies? Why do both writers and scholars of Indian English literature express resistance to India and Indianness? What does this reveal about how non-Western literatures are read, taught, and understood? Drawing on years of experiences in classrooms and on U.S. university campuses, Ragini Tharoor Srinivasan explores how writers, critics, teachers, and students of Indian English literatures negotiate and resist the categories through which the field is defined: ethnic, postcolonial, and Anglophone.

Overdetermined: How Indian English Literature Becomes Ethnic, Postcolonial, and Anglophone (Columbia UP, 2025) considers major contemporary authors who disavow identity even as their works and public personas respond in varied ways to the imperatives of being “Indian.” Chapters examine Bharati Mukherjee’s rejection of “ethnic” Americanness; Chetan Bhagat’s “bad English”; Amit Chaudhuri’s autofictional literary project; and Jhumpa Lahiri’s decision to write in Italian, interspersed with meditations on the iconicity of the theorists Gayatri Chakravorty Spivak, Homi Bhabha, and Edward Said. Through an innovative method of accented reading and sharing stories and syllabi from her teaching, Srinivasan relates the burdens of representation faced by ethnic and postcolonial writers to the institutional and disciplinary pressures that affect the scholars who study their works. Engaging and self-reflexive, Overdetermined offers new insight into the dynamics that shape contemporary Indian English literature, the politics of identity in literary studies, and the complexities of teaching minoritized literatures in the West.

Ragini Tharoor Srinivasan is assistant professor of English at Rice University. Her books include the essays What is We? (2025) and the coedited Thinking with an Accent: Toward a New Object, Method, and Practice (2023), and her public writing has appeared in numerous venues.

Morteza Hajizadeh is a Ph.D. graduate in English from the University of Auckland in New Zealand. His research interests are Cultural Studies; Critical Theory; Environmental History; Medieval (Intellectual) History; Gothic Studies; 18th and 19th Century British Literature.

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What A Day - Will SCOTUS Greenlight Trump’s Worst Ideas?

The new Supreme Court term started on Monday, and the justices have a lot on their plates. They’ll be deciding a host of big issues in the coming months – including if Trump can fire board members of the Federal Reserve and whether his tariff policy is overstepping presidential authority. But first, on Tuesday, the court heard arguments in Chiles v. Salazar, a case focused on whether conversion talk-therapy for minors is protected by the First Amendment. So, for more on this Supreme Court term and what we can expect, we spoke to Kate Shaw, co-host of Crooked Media’s Strict Scrutiny and a law professor at the University of Pennsylvania.

And in headlines, National Guard troops arrive at an Army training center outside of Chicago, Attorney General Pam Bondi avoids questions from Democratic lawmakers, and more terrible news for furloughed federal workers.

Show Notes:


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The NewsWorthy - Shutdown Backpay Threat, AG Bondi Grilled & Gold’s Record Run – Wednesday, October 8, 2025

The news to know for Wednesday, October 8, 2025!

What to know about a White House memo that could leave federal workers without back pay after the government shutdown.

And the heated Senate showdown with Attorney General Pam Bondi that turned personal.

Plus: why gold prices just hit record highs, which state is turning down the volume on loud streaming commercials, and what new data shows about the “9-9-6” work trend making its way to the U.S.

 

Those stories and even more news to know in about 10 minutes! 

 

Join us every Mon-Fri for more daily news roundups! 

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The Best One Yet - 🥇 “$4K” — Gold’s “debasement” trade. Rowan’s $150M Ear Piercing. Sharpies’ Made in America. +Netflix’s Loud Ad Law.

Gold reached a record $4,000/ounce… but this gold run is different than any in history.

How is Rowan doing $150M in sales of ear piercings for girls?... The Window of Loyalty.

Sharpie Markers figured out the formula for Made in America… Now it’s a Pen Profit Puppy.

Plus, notice those Netflix commercials are too loud?... Well there’s a new law to turn ‘em down.


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Planet Money - Two ways AI is changing the business of crime (Two Indicators)

Pre-order the Planet Money book here for your free gift. 

Our sister show, The Indicator, is chronicling the evolving business of crime for its Vice Week series. Today, we bring to you two cases of crime in the age of AI. 

First, cybercriminals are using our own voices against us. Audio deepfake scams are picking up against individuals but also against businesses. We hear from a bank on how they’re adapting defenses, and find out how the new defenses are a game of AI vs AI. 

Then, we move over to the stock market to witness AI market manipulation. A new breed of trading bots behave differently. They could collude with each other, even without human involvement or instruction, so researchers are asking how to think about blame, and regulation in a world of more sophisticated trading bots. That’s assuming regulators could even keep up with the tech in the first place. 

Indicator Vice Series 
Head to The Indicator from Planet Money podcast feed for the latest on the Indicator Vice Series including an episode on data breaches . If you don’t already subscribe, check it out. Each episode explains one slice of the economy connected to the news recently, always in 10 minutes or less. 

Subscribe to Planet Money+ 

Listen free: Apple Podcasts, Spotify, the NPR app or anywhere you get podcasts.

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This episode is hosted by Darian Woods, Adrian Ma, and Wailin Wong. These episodes of The Indicator were originally produced by Cooper Katz McKim and engineered by Robert Rodriguez. They were fact-checked by Sierra Juarez. Kate Concannon is The Indicator’s editor. Alex Goldmark is the Executive Producer. 

Music: NPR Source Audio - “Diamond High” 

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The Indicator from Planet Money - When cartels start to diversify

The Sinaloa Cartel made the bulk of its money on cocaine. But cartels are diversifying into new operations including things like wildlife trafficking. Think sharks, jaguars, capybaras. The result is something called “narco-degradation.” On today’s show, we look at what’s driving cartels beyond drugs and how this is wreaking havoc on ecosystems in Central America.

Related episodes: 
Can breaking the law be good for business? 
Waste Land 
Will Economic Growth Destroy the Planet? For sponsor-free episodes of The Indicator from Planet Money, subscribe to Planet Money+ via Apple Podcasts or at plus.npr.org. Fact-checking by Sierra Juarez. Music by Drop Electric. Find us: TikTok, Instagram, Facebook, Newsletter.  

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